The Truth About Identity Release Programs - Page 2

01-30-2005, 07:36 AM

BTW, babylove, feel free to email me.
nathanzmom@yahoo.com

**BC-KarenS-MI** · 01-30-2005, 02:15 PM

The problem isn't in giving our own personal thoughts & opinions. The problem comes in when people start to bash the ones who don't agree with them! THAT'S where the problems come in. I don't believe anyone has EVER said that they mind sharing the reasons why THEY personally chose to tell/not tell, KWIM? So, saying that if you don't like the topic of the post, then don't open, isn't fair. We all have the right to post what our thoughts are, but no one has the right to tell another person that they are wrong for the decision that they have made. I have NO problem sharing my reasons for not telling, but I DO have a problem when someone steps in & tells me that I obviously haven't done any research on the subject & that I'm harming my kids!! That's where the line gets drawn in the sand.

And honestly, it doesn't make any difference whether it's DS or DE that's used, the basic issues are the same.

Karen

SueZ · 01-30-2005, 09:06 PM

Karen, everything you say it totally right on track. I feel the same way. Just because I may have different opinions and thoughts on how I may feel, I would never try to tell anyone that what they are doing is wrong, just because it differs from my beliefs and feelings.

I have never thought of identity release. What is that, when the name of the donor would be given to your child if they asked for it? Anyway, really, I know my kids may have questions someday and that's what the profiles I have on the donors are for, to maybe shed some light on some things, what color hair donor had, what nationality he was, etc., but would never want the identity release thing and honestly, to us, it doesn't feel like we did donor, I can't imagine our sons asking to meet the donor. We're their parents and I can only hope and pray that's going to be enough for them, they won't be that curious

Janie-OR · 01-31-2005, 09:38 AM

I totally agree with Karen and SueZ about the bashing and the decisions we have made.

By the way, Babylove, you say that you weren't asking about DE, but you were -- in your original post above and embedded in another one below. Regardless, issues and challenges are the same. There is probably more information on disclosure available about DS than DE, becuase DS has been around much, much longer -- since before WWII. DE has been available for the last 20 or so years.

Janie

01-31-2005, 09:44 AM

Maybe you misunderstood the point I wanted to make: that people should be able to post a topic they want to discuss, and no one is forced to read it.

I never said people should be able to freely bash other members.

Discussing a legitimate topic in an educational manner is not the same thing as having a free-for-all with name calling or deliberately insulting those on the other side of the fence.

billdiadoptee · 02-03-2005, 12:33 AM

Babylove,

I am one of those who not only favor openness and disclosure but actively promote openness in all ART. When I talk about the negative effects of secrecy and how it's affected my life, people think I being judgmental. All I can say is that I know over 150 other adults conceived through donor insemination. In a survey I conducted for a publication in Japan, 100% of all DI adults believe that all DI children ought to be told at an early age, regardless of family situations. Over 95% believe that we should have the right to know our genetic roots. therefore, it is very important that identity release donors be favored.

Bill Cordray
born throguh DI in 1945
Salt Lake City

tommysmom · 02-08-2005, 12:30 PM

I have read this thread and am somewhat confused about the statistics being bandied about. Are there any percentages, numbers or studies done on DI children that do not know their conceptive origin? I would think not, since those people would be impossible to identify. The very nature of the non-disclosure would preclude them from even being considered in a study. Before the advent of DNA testing, I would love to read about statistics and studies on disclosure. I find it extremely hard to fathom that all people who do not know and have no reason to suspect anything unorthodox or unusual in their conception would suffer a negative impact from a condition or state of events they are completely unaware of. I just don't understand how these studies can be definitive or conclusive when such an arguably large percentage of the group cannot even be identified.

While I have no doubt that the discovery of DI when it was not known before must be horribly traumatic, I am just curious as to how the decision not to disclose can be condemned when there are no pertinent studies as to that particular situation.

Anyone have any information?

02-08-2005, 02:23 PM

1. Yes, actually there have been some studies done on DI kids who didn't know, but the only ones I know of were all very young (preschool). You can't tell much at that point.

2. You are right that parents who are not disclosing DI generally don't participate in research studies..especially not parents of older children.

3. Even though parents don't tell their children about the DI, that doesn't mean that the children don't suspect something is wrong. Bill (post above yours) is himself a DI conceived person. He has done DI research, he runs a group for adults who are DI conceived, and he speaks at conferences world-wide about DI. He and many other DI-adults he knows suspected that they were adopted, or that their mother had an affair to have them; and some just knew something was amiss, but didn't know what. Some DI teens and adults express relief when they are told about the DI. "Okay, I'm not crazy, there really was something going on."

I think you are wise to ask people where they get their info. A lot of mine is from:

Zolbrod, A. P. (1993). Men, women, and infertility: Intervention and treatment strategies. and:

Vercollone, C. F., Moss, H., & Moss, R. (1997). Helping the stork: The choices and challenges of donor insemination.

02-08-2005, 02:26 PM

PS: I just read your post again, Tommysmom, and the numbers Bill uses are from his own published research study on 150 DI adults. Many of them didn't know until they were adults, and THEY are the ones who said they had negative experiences even before finding out.

tommysmom · 02-08-2005, 05:37 PM

thanks for responding, nathanzmom! I have read Helping the Stork and will check out your other source.

I read and understood Bill's post, and would expect that all those who found out about their conception felt betrayed and groundless. My main curiousity is those DI children and adults who have never been told. Are they predestined to be miserable? How can we know they effects of never telling when so many of the demographic do not know their origins? I understand the study Bill did was with DI adults who found out later in life, what puzzles me is the confidence people have when they say that the DI child will "know" something is "off". That's what intrigues me. How do they "know"? Is it something inherent, beyond the normal adolescent identity angst? Does it depend on the parents, their child rearing ability, etc? Have all DI adults, those who know their origins, and those who don't have any clue, experienced this sense of not "belonging"?

Sorry for the gazillion questions, thanks again for the sources!

01-30-2005, 02:15 PM	#12 (permalink)
BC-KarenS-MI Board Coordinator Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Michigan Posts: 28,043	The problem isn't in giving our own personal thoughts & opinions. The problem comes in when people start to bash the ones who don't agree with them! THAT'S where the problems come in. I don't believe anyone has EVER said that they mind sharing the reasons why THEY personally chose to tell/not tell, KWIM? So, saying that if you don't like the topic of the post, then don't open, isn't fair. We all have the right to post what our thoughts are, but no one has the right to tell another person that they are wrong for the decision that they have made. I have NO problem sharing my reasons for not telling, but I DO have a problem when someone steps in & tells me that I obviously haven't done any research on the subject & that I'm harming my kids!! That's where the line gets drawn in the sand. And honestly, it doesn't make any difference whether it's DS or DE that's used, the basic issues are the same. Karen __________________ ttc #1 for 7 1/2 years ~ IVF #1, 6-93, cancelled; IVF#2/rescue ICSI- 7-99, failed ~(switched RE's) ZIFT/ICSI- 1-00, successful w/twins, lost 1 at 8w ~ ZIFT/ICSI #2, to try for #2- March '03- successful ~ GS- IVF #1, 7-05 failed. FET 10-05- BFP, m/c 5w5d

01-30-2005, 09:06 PM	#13 (permalink)
SueZ 1000-4999 post queen of hearts Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Westchester, New York Posts: 2,203	Karen, everything you say it totally right on track. I feel the same way. Just because I may have different opinions and thoughts on how I may feel, I would never try to tell anyone that what they are doing is wrong, just because it differs from my beliefs and feelings. I have never thought of identity release. What is that, when the name of the donor would be given to your child if they asked for it? Anyway, really, I know my kids may have questions someday and that's what the profiles I have on the donors are for, to maybe shed some light on some things, what color hair donor had, what nationality he was, etc., but would never want the identity release thing and honestly, to us, it doesn't feel like we did donor, I can't imagine our sons asking to meet the donor. We're their parents and I can only hope and pray that's going to be enough for them, they won't be that curious __________________ Suzanne ^!^ Zachary, 5/3/98-5/4/98, born 36 weeks, genetic kidney disease m/c Nicholas Zachary, December '99 Jesse Daniel, 9/4/03

02-03-2005, 12:33 AM	#16 (permalink)
billdiadoptee Registered User Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Salt Lake City, Utah Posts: 28	Babylove, I am one of those who not only favor openness and disclosure but actively promote openness in all ART. When I talk about the negative effects of secrecy and how it's affected my life, people think I being judgmental. All I can say is that I know over 150 other adults conceived through donor insemination. In a survey I conducted for a publication in Japan, 100% of all DI adults believe that all DI children ought to be told at an early age, regardless of family situations. Over 95% believe that we should have the right to know our genetic roots. therefore, it is very important that identity release donors be favored. Bill Cordray born throguh DI in 1945 Salt Lake City __________________ Bill Cordray Born through DI 1945

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01-30-2005, 07:36 AM	#11 (permalink)
nathanzmom Guest Posts: n/a	BTW, babylove, feel free to email me. nathanzmom@yahoo.com

01-31-2005, 09:38 AM	#14 (permalink)
Janie-OR Registered User Join Date: Jan 2002 Posts: 760	I totally agree with Karen and SueZ about the bashing and the decisions we have made. By the way, Babylove, you say that you weren't asking about DE, but you were -- in your original post above and embedded in another one below. Regardless, issues and challenges are the same. There is probably more information on disclosure available about DS than DE, becuase DS has been around much, much longer -- since before WWII. DE has been available for the last 20 or so years. Janie

01-31-2005, 09:44 AM	#15 (permalink)
nathanzmom Guest Posts: n/a	Maybe you misunderstood the point I wanted to make: that people should be able to post a topic they want to discuss, and no one is forced to read it. I never said people should be able to freely bash other members. Discussing a legitimate topic in an educational manner is not the same thing as having a free-for-all with name calling or deliberately insulting those on the other side of the fence.

02-08-2005, 12:30 PM	#17 (permalink)
tommysmom Registered User Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: New York Posts: 29	I have read this thread and am somewhat confused about the statistics being bandied about. Are there any percentages, numbers or studies done on DI children that do not know their conceptive origin? I would think not, since those people would be impossible to identify. The very nature of the non-disclosure would preclude them from even being considered in a study. Before the advent of DNA testing, I would love to read about statistics and studies on disclosure. I find it extremely hard to fathom that all people who do not know and have no reason to suspect anything unorthodox or unusual in their conception would suffer a negative impact from a condition or state of events they are completely unaware of. I just don't understand how these studies can be definitive or conclusive when such an arguably large percentage of the group cannot even be identified. While I have no doubt that the discovery of DI when it was not known before must be horribly traumatic, I am just curious as to how the decision not to disclose can be condemned when there are no pertinent studies as to that particular situation. Anyone have any information?

02-08-2005, 02:23 PM	#18 (permalink)
nathanzmom Guest Posts: n/a	1. Yes, actually there have been some studies done on DI kids who didn't know, but the only ones I know of were all very young (preschool). You can't tell much at that point. 2. You are right that parents who are not disclosing DI generally don't participate in research studies..especially not parents of older children. 3. Even though parents don't tell their children about the DI, that doesn't mean that the children don't suspect something is wrong. Bill (post above yours) is himself a DI conceived person. He has done DI research, he runs a group for adults who are DI conceived, and he speaks at conferences world-wide about DI. He and many other DI-adults he knows suspected that they were adopted, or that their mother had an affair to have them; and some just knew something was amiss, but didn't know what. Some DI teens and adults express relief when they are told about the DI. "Okay, I'm not crazy, there really was something going on." I think you are wise to ask people where they get their info. A lot of mine is from: Zolbrod, A. P. (1993). Men, women, and infertility: Intervention and treatment strategies. and: Vercollone, C. F., Moss, H., & Moss, R. (1997). Helping the stork: The choices and challenges of donor insemination.

02-08-2005, 02:26 PM	#19 (permalink)
nathanzmom Guest Posts: n/a	PS: I just read your post again, Tommysmom, and the numbers Bill uses are from his own published research study on 150 DI adults. Many of them didn't know until they were adults, and THEY are the ones who said they had negative experiences even before finding out.

02-08-2005, 05:37 PM	#20 (permalink)
tommysmom Registered User Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: New York Posts: 29	thanks for responding, nathanzmom! I have read Helping the Stork and will check out your other source. I read and understood Bill's post, and would expect that all those who found out about their conception felt betrayed and groundless. My main curiousity is those DI children and adults who have never been told. Are they predestined to be miserable? How can we know they effects of never telling when so many of the demographic do not know their origins? I understand the study Bill did was with DI adults who found out later in life, what puzzles me is the confidence people have when they say that the DI child will "know" something is "off". That's what intrigues me. How do they "know"? Is it something inherent, beyond the normal adolescent identity angst? Does it depend on the parents, their child rearing ability, etc? Have all DI adults, those who know their origins, and those who don't have any clue, experienced this sense of not "belonging"? Sorry for the gazillion questions, thanks again for the sources!