Franken Amendment

[Maddy00]

So OzMel, answer please. Do you feel Obama's refusal to aknowledge ACORN and that whole debacle (even pretended to not know anything was going on with them) is tacit approval of what they did?

Yes or no question.

[robine]

I do not expect an answer..

[OzMel]

Why not? I've not shied away from answering the hard questions

I am, however, at work. I do not know the ins and outs of the ACORN issues (hence my not raising of them in the first place and my lack of commentary on the threads.lol ) so it is something I need to research. The one thing I have learnt is that the 'truth' is not going to lie on this board..

Do you feel Obama's refusal to aknowledge ACORN and that whole debacle (even pretended to not know anything was going on with them) is tacit approval of what they did? Yes or no question.

How can it be a yes or no question if it is not entirely accurate? Or maybe you should clarify as to whether you are talking about Obama personally, or the WH?

I'll have an initial go at answering though. If ACORN had kept receiving grants and kept ties to the Census bureau, then yes, I would call that tacit approval. If there was no statement by the WH critical of the 'debacle' then yes, I would call tacit approval.

I'll keep playing if you like but can you at least give me a clue as to the relevance of ACORN to my initial question. I get enough of the " but Mum, he did it first.." type stuff at home so if it is more than that, clue me in, please As I have said though, what's the big deal. Obviously it sits just fine with you and I'm happy to accept that..

[Maddy00]

How about you research that whole silly ACORN thing and then get back to me. I'd rather get an informed answer than a snarky, insulting, dodging one.

[OzMel]

Originally Posted by Maddy00

How about you research that whole silly ACORN thing and then get back to me. I'd rather get an informed answer than a snarky, insulting, dodging one.

Sorry, I've answered the best I can without further clarification from you. I've asked for it and if you don't want to provide it, fine.

I'm also at a loss as to why exactly you expect me to research the ACORN thing if you find it silly. I've been quite clear in my lack of knowledge. I did not bring it up and it was not at all relevant to the issue I had

I'm sorry if you find it snarky, insulting and dodging for me to answer as I did. It was an affirmative answer after all and I realise you were expecting the negative. You didn't get it so we are off on a dodgerama

For your benefit, as you seem to have missed it or misconstrued it as snarky and whatever...

If ACORN had kept receiving grants and kept ties to the Census bureau, then yes, I would call that tacit approval. If there was no statement by the WH critical of the 'debacle' then yes, I would call tacit approval.

[BC-tinatinva]

Originally Posted by OzMel

sorry, I don't find it 'reasonable' so a 'Liberal attack on reasonableness' doesn't fly.

I also don't find your justification valid. There was a known situation that needed to be addressed. THIS amendment IS in the right place. If there are any others that need to be brought forth, then maybe one of those 30 could step forward and make it fairer for all
Calling out the contractor that allowed this situation to occur isn't 'right'?? Why don't you make it clearer to me as to what exactly the problem is with calling out the responsible party? It's not fair??
Is your argument that it is preferable to leave it open to others to potentially go through the same thing because, it's not fair. Starting with defence contractors, where the issue occured, is not a reasonable place to begin?

That this is somehow NOT about protecting vested interests and corporate ties is laughable to me and I will simply have to agree to disagree. I see it as ALL about protecting business at all cost.

I stand my ground. Why have to put it in every contract legislation? I actually find it ludicrous that it needs to even be put in legislation at all. I cannot believe that there isn't already a law against such a thing. Probably is.
Did you have any comment on the trranscript? Did you read it? Your OP alluded to a desire to understand it, yet you seem to want to argue some made up argument on my part about fairness.

Given your comment on starting with defence contractors and you insistence that it is about corporate greed, I am assuming that you did not read the transcript of the discussion. It's really hard to debate facts with your made up assumptions.

[OzMel]

Actually, I did read the transcript and didn't find anything to justify voting AGAINST the amendment. If anything, it reinforces the importance of closing this loophole and is obviously why most voted for it. Personally, I think, and obviously I'm not alone, that those 30 who voted against look like tools and as such, their motives must definitely be questioned. You don't agree and I don't mind. I think the facts speak for themselves, as do you, though I'm not sure we were reading the same thing

I particularly found Nelson's words quite shocking as I was unaware it was THAT bad for women in Iraq. I'm sure you realise that this incident was far from an isolated one. Sorry, but if this stops the horrendous sexual attacks and treatment of citizens overseas then I STILL don't see how one can not support it. The alternative isn't very palatable. To me, anyway. Obviously, I'm in the minority in this thread.lol

Why have to put it in every contract legislation? I actually find it ludicrous that it needs to even be put in legislation at all. I cannot believe that there isn't already a law against such a thing. Probably is.

I agree. Kind of. Ludicrous that this action needs to be taken. Ludicrous that

When similar crimes are committed within the United States, on a permanent military base, or at one of our embassies overseas, the authority and responsibility to prosecute these crimes is clear. Yet because these crimes were committed abroad and the victims were civilians, their stories never see the light of day. There is no jury, no public record and no transcript.

Looking at this issue was a very interesting experience. I learnt way more than I expected to

You stand firm and that is fine. I don't get it but that's fine too.

[robine]

Originally Posted by OzMel

Sorry, I've answered the best I can without further clarification from you. I've asked for it and if you don't want to provide it, fine.

I'm also at a loss as to why exactly you expect me to research the ACORN thing if you find it silly. I've been quite clear in my lack of knowledge. I did not bring it up and it was not at all relevant to the issue I had

I'm sorry if you find it snarky, insulting and dodging for me to answer as I did. It was an affirmative answer after all and I realise you were expecting the negative. You didn't get it so we are off on a dodgerama

For your benefit, as you seem to have missed it or misconstrued it as snarky and whatever...

yet you felt informed enough about ACORN to mock my response.


I am not buying it..CLASSIC dive, dip , dodge, divert,

typical

[OzMel]

Originally Posted by robine

yet you felt informed enough about ACORN to mock my response.


I am not buying it..CLASSIC dive, dip , dodge, divert,

typical

Hon, I suggest you go back and read my post responding to you. S.L.O.W.L.Y..

Only one (or two) queens of the 4 D's here

[robine]

Originally Posted by OzMel

Hon, I suggest you go back and read my post responding to you. S.L.O.W.L.Y..

Only one (or two) queens of the 4 D's here

This rude snarky one????



ote:
Originally Posted by robine View Post
quote:
but rather the whole shady loophole that gives NO recourse to such treatment


__________________________________________________ __Robine:___________________
does this apply then to corruption within ACORN perhaps that likes to provide little girls to be raped??


I do not think they have any recourse... I have not heard any strong statements from the WH condemning their actions


OzMel:
Typical

One of the clearest applications of the 4D's I've seen for a while. I purposely refrained from the comparison, despite the dozens of variations to this theme..